Geissele Tavor Trigger

The IWI Tavor, in my limited use thus far with it, is a great rifle.  We all know that Tim (MAC) has a slight fondness for it as well.  While it does take some getting used to, especially if you are used to handling a conventional rifle such as an AR or AK, I can see the great potential this rifle offers.  If I were asked to name one weakness on the Tavor, it would be the very heavy factory trigger.  When I first got my Tavor, I performed the Tavor trigger job that Tim documented in a video some seven months ago, but even then, it is still lacking the crispness I have become accustomed to with even the most basic mil-spec AR trigger.  While that is not an unusual trait in a bullpup, it is still something that I feel needs addressing.

TopJust days before SHOT Show, Bill Geissele posted a picture on Facebook, a picture in which he was holding a Tavor trigger pack that was most noticeably not factory.  I had a chance to talk with Bill at SHOT and was even luckier to get my hands on his Tavor equipped with his new trigger pack.  The trigger pack in the attached photos was removed from his gun to allow me to photograph it.  This Tavor trigger was a one of a kind, prototype item and I was honored to be given the opportunity to play with it.  To say the trigger was improved would be like saying the Hoover Dam was a tiny obstruction in a small creek.

Bill described it as being designed along the same line as his other Super Semi-Automatic (SSA) triggers.  This new Tavor trigger I was tickling is designed to be a combat trigger, which is what I would be looking for in a newBottom trigger.  The trigger was a 2-stage design, with the first stage very light, and at the end there is a noticeable wall, which according to Bill breaks at 4.5 pounds.  While I did not have my trigger scale in my pocket, my finger would have to agree (at least ballpark).  It was significantly lighter than the stock trigger, but also offered better feel.

Bill said the trigger pack will come as a drop in unit and will offer an adjustable first stage, a non-adjustable second stage with adjustable over travel.   The whole unit is made by them and the trigger pack chassis (for lack of a better term) will be CNC machined aluminum and the final models will be anodized.  He said the complete unit will hit the streets, barring any unforeseen obstacles, in March 2014 and will have a list price of $350.Top2

Matt

Matt is a full time Deputy Sheriff that has been on the job for 17 years. During his time as a LEO he's attended countless training classes and is a court recognized firearms expert. Matt brings a unique perspective to TBS given his LEO experience and life time appreciation of firearms and our 2nd Amendment rights.

More Posts

Follow Me:
TwitterFacebook

  • Chris Upchurch

    I tried the Geissele Tavor trigger at SHOT, and it is certainly worlds better than the stock Tavor trigger. I also tried the Timney Tavor trigger, and found it even better than the Geissele. For those who are into the Tavor I’d give the Timney some consideration as well.

    • Matt

      Chris, I know Tim has plans to test the Timney product in the near future, that is if he has not gotten his hands on one already. Unfortunately, I never made it to the Timney booth before I fled Vegas.

    • Mike C.

      I’ll second that having tried both at SHOT

  • Mike

    I have to throw this red meat out there…Let the Timney/Geissele Tavor trigger arguments begin! In three…two…one…

    I haven’t bought a Tavor yet, but it tops my short list. I’ve been reading pretty much everything I can get my hands on regarding the rifle and it is good to see that there will be options out there to remedy what appears to be the biggest shortcoming of the rifle.

    Matt, good writeup and thanks for sharing your SHOT experience with us. I definitely enjoy reading about the experience as well as what is coming down the pipe. Hope you and Tim are feeling better quickly!

  • Paelorian

    Nice look at the Geissele Tavor trigger, Matt. I’m looking forward to seeing some honest comparisons once the three big triggers announced have been tested: the Geissele, Timney, and ShootingSight. The Timney is a single-stage, Geissele and ShootingSight are two-stage. I’m particularly interested in the two-stage triggers as I’d intend to keep a Tavor as a combat-oriented weapon. Matt Korovesis at OutdoorHub has the only article out right now that directly compares the three and lists their specifications, and after dry-firing all three his initial impression favors the ShootingSight over the Geissele for a combat trigger: “The ShootingSight piece provides everything I could ask for in a combat rifle trigger.” http://www.outdoorhub.com/stories/aftermarket-tavor-trigger-roundup/

    One thing I’d really like to know about these new triggers is if they have any caveats. Reliability is my concern. My worry is largely abated by the reputations of these experienced trigger designers, but I’d still like to be assured that these triggers offer no compromise in reliability. The Tavor is an extremely reliable weapon designed for environments that are challenging to a rifle. When Tim took that extra reset spring out of the stock trigger pack, IWI warned him that reliability might be affected. I’m sure that extra spring was in there for a reason. It might only be necessary for reliability in extreme conditions (sandstorm, mud, etc.) but I am very reluctant to sacrifice any reliability in any weapon or tool I’d be relying on to save my life. Until more public testing is done, the stock trigger pack is the only one with a proven record of reliability, including a combat record of reliability.

    I expect having an aftermarket trigger pack will be a must-have for Tavor users. If I’d been an IDF troop, I would have been heavily supporting the American civilian release of the Tavor just so that I could get my hands on one of these triggers! Israel and other states should take note, that releasing their weapons to the USA civilian market can improve their weapons with aftermarket parts. See also Gear Head Works, etc.

    • Daniel

      Soldiers are currently using the Micro-Tavor (X-95) in the IDF, the Tavor having already been phased out of the 3 infantry brigades who were using the rifle (Nahal, Golani, Givati). The Micro Tavor’s trigger is better than the trigger in the original Tavor (crisper break with less creep), however it is still not better than a quality AR trigger.

      If any unit would be able to get a hold of such an expensive addition to an already expensive rifle, it would most likely be one of the smaller SF units like Eggoz, and not one of the infantry brigades that might help knock the price of an item like this down with a large order. Another reason why that probably wouldn’t happen is, because A) the culture in the IDF is not to spend money on military equipment as an individual soldier, and B) because as you said, the new trigger has not been tested like the old one was, so it probably wont be allowed to be used inside of the IDF.

  • Craig_H

    Very interesting! My Tavor trigger is not terrible, but a Geissele drop-in trigger may be the icing on the cake for my favorite rifle. The only problem will be deciding between it and the Timney, if both provide the same performance and comparable prices.

    • José Pulido

      FALSE. All Tavor triggers are actually terrible!(I tease,) but if tradition holds true, the Timney will be closer to a competition trigger while the Tavor will be closer to “combat” trigger. The Timney should be hands down better, while the Geissele should be more trustworthy to fire any of the hardest military primers.

  • Chris

    I do not think the Tavor needs a lighter trigger. My comment is not
    directed at those who already own a Tavor and would like to use it in completion
    or enjoy accessorizing their rifle. If you want to put a lighter trigger in then
    awesome. I think that a Geissele or Timney trigger would be money well spent.
    But it’s a 300 plus dollar proposition on a rifle that for practical purpose
    costs the end user about 2,000 dollars. For someone who may be looking at the
    Tavor as a rifle for self-defense or Constitutional- defense in a time a great
    trouble (I mean that as it sounds), I think that the regular talk about the
    Tavor’s heavy trigger may drive them away. The Tavor was designed and
    redesigned and fielded to be given to an 18 year old conscript, and as such it
    is a viable and good option for someone wanting a quality rifle who may have
    never owned one before. I have had my Tavor for about 3 months now. I think it’s
    the best bullpup out there. I own an AUG and an FN too, and the Tavor just works
    better. It does not care what magazine you use, what ammo you use, or what
    handed you are. It’s also easy to use, and easy to take apart. So if you are
    thinking about it as a rifle for you (specifically a fighting rifle), and you are
    trying to make good decisions with your hard earned money, I would not hesitate
    to buy it. And I certainly would not worry about the trigger. Off hand with a
    zero magnification red dot, I can put it on a man sized steel target at 200
    yards consistently. Prone I can do it out to 400 yards. Buy some A-zoom snap
    caps and spend a week doing dedicated dry fire and you’ll be able to control
    the trigger well enough to use the weapon well. The added bonus is that you
    will also get the practice of manipulating the action, mag release, and bolt release.
    So to summarize this is not a jab at those who want a lighter trigger. It is
    simply a statement to those who may be on the fence about the rifle that a
    lighter trigger is not needed.

    • Ken Hagler

      I took my new Tavor to the range for the first time yesterday, and while I’d agree that a lighter trigger isn’t _necessary_, it’s certainly desirable–especially if you shoot it quite a bit. The heavy trigger didn’t bother me at all when I was firing the first magazine (I thought it felt better than the lighter FS2000 trigger), but by the seventh magazine I’d lost all feeling in the tip of my trigger finger and was thinking IWI should supply a cranequin to go with their trigger.

  • Daniel

    I know people keep harping on the trigger of this rifle, specifically noting its heavy break, but I was always more annoyed with the creep I used to feel in the issued triggers. My new Tavor SAR has some of the same creep, but the trigger does feel a bit better than it used to be.

    The question that I have, is related to the redesign of the BCG. Tavor SARs have cutouts in the gas piston, an added spring around the firing pin (another piece to lose when cleaning a weapon in the field), and are generally harder to clean since the guide rod and plastic backing cannot be separated from the recoil spring assembly and removed like on the TAR-21.

    My biggest concern is that the cutouts in the piston moving carbon into hard to clean areas (such as the inside of the piston), or even moving carbon throughout the rifle via the moving spring.

    Matt, what do you know about these differences? Have you noticed anything like I mentioned after shooting your Tavor for extended periods of time? Any idea if someone is going to offer a heavy barrel for the Tavor anytime soon?

    -Daniel

  • Docmo

    I recently purchased a Tavor and have to agree that it’s Achilles heel is the trigger. I just finished my SRT qualification with it and the one shot that I dropped out was due to the heavy trigger pull at distance. Other than the trigger it is the perfect entry gun. Is is shorter than our teams UMP 45′s with a full length 16″ barrel in a rifle caliber, ambidextrous, accurate, maneuverable, and (so far through 750 rounds) utterly reliable even in -30 wind chill and snow.

    The rifle has received one of two reviews from my fellow officers, they love it or they hate it. When pressed as to why they hate it the universal answer is because of the “$&@?!” trigger. I have become more comfortable with the trigger through practice but also agree an improved trigger (assuming the weapon continues to be reliable with higher round counts) would make this a perfect entry/perimeter rifle.

    I am anxiously awaiting an improved trigger (either Geissele or Timeny) so as to perfect what I consider an already impressive rifle. I was worried about spending $1,700 on this rifle but so far I feel it was money well spent IMHO.

  • Stephen Fogg

    Galloway Precision also is in the process of releasing Tavor trigger upgrades. They will soon offer two separate products: an improved sear and reduced power sear spring kit and an adjustable trigger. The company does not indicate what the effect would be in terms of reduced trigger pull if both products were installed. Together the two kits would be just over $100–considerably cheaper than either Geisselle or Timney. Galloway has no ETA as to availability. As of right now all of the Tavor trigger upgrades are unavailable.